We don't mind when you do it. :mrgreen:klimov wrote:Quite another for some unqualified lughead to start passing judgement
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This is a snakeskin jacket. And for me it's a symbol of my individuality and my belief in personal freedom.
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I'm sure Kubrick himself would appreciate your "every frame is perfection!" take on EWS, but I'll bet he wouldn't agree. What we have is the very first finished copy presented to the studio; what filmmaker WOULDN'T have some cuts to make after handing that in, much less perfectionist Stanley?klimov wrote:Alexhead - it's one thing for Kubrick himself to make some subtle tweaks to his work approaching or even during the release. Quite another for some unqualified lughead to start passing judgement
I suspect if you were editing the thing it'd be 20 minutes longer, you know, let the pathos really breathe and all :mrgreen:
"I'm like a dog chasing cars, I wouldn't know what to do if I caught one. . . . I'm not a schemer. I just do things."
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Exactly! Had he not died, he would've had four whole months to mess around with the thing. I somehow doubt he was planning to just sit around on his ass, naming his cats.Alexhead wrote:What we have is the very first finished copy presented to the studio; what filmmaker WOULDN'T have some cuts to make after handing that in, much less perfectionist Stanley?
This is a snakeskin jacket. And for me it's a symbol of my individuality and my belief in personal freedom.
24
But then why present it to the studio, Cruise and Kidman at all unless it was finished? His contract was perhaps unique, in that he had an unlimited amount of time to work on the film before delivery. Yeah, he MAY or MAY NOT have made some tweaks in the following months, but the film as it stands is in no way a rough cut or a draft, at least visually (the sound dub hadn't been completed).
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My recollection is that it was the first cut he had presented to the studio, not necessarily the final. And while I'm truly glad you love every frame of the thing, I doubt many agree as to its flawlessness...and I suspect Kubrick would've put some trims in. Guess we'll never know.
At least Speilberg gave him a triumphant eulogy with A.I., right?
:mrgreen:
At least Speilberg gave him a triumphant eulogy with A.I., right?
:mrgreen:"I'm like a dog chasing cars, I wouldn't know what to do if I caught one. . . . I'm not a schemer. I just do things."
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it's not a question of "flawlessness". Nothing is Flawless. He may or may not have decided to make some small changes as the release approached, but why present a knowlingly unfinished cut to the studio?
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I don't know that Alexhead and I are suggesting it was knowlingly unfinished. (Alexhead calls it the "very first finished copy presented to the studio.") Our argument is that it's probable he would've spent the four months before its July release tinkering with the cut. That's what he did on his previous movies, sometimes even past the release date (e.g., 2001, The Shining). Even you concede that "he may or may not have decided to make some small changes as the release approached," so the matter of dispute here seems to only be a matter of degree.
This is a snakeskin jacket. And for me it's a symbol of my individuality and my belief in personal freedom.
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Not to mention a fairly moot point since we'll never know for sure.
"I'm like a dog chasing cars, I wouldn't know what to do if I caught one. . . . I'm not a schemer. I just do things."
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given that only a temp audio track existed, I would suggest that most of those four months would have been spent on the sound.
2001 is a special case, given its particularly 'musical' composition and episodic, epic nature, which encourage a continued tinkering. This was also the late 60s, never again would Kubrick enact such drastic changes...
...except in the case of The Shining, which was an attempt to make a more commercial genre film, thus the attempt to tighten the pace inbetween the US and European releases (although both cuts remain available). He also cut a brief coda after the premiere, but there is no such scene that might be obviously cut from Eyes Wide Shut.
A Clockwork Orange, Barry Lyndon and Full Metal Jacket remain pretty much as is. So I see no evidence to suggest that the EWS would have changed, though one cannot, of course, entirely reject the possibility. However, it seems to me the argument is primarily used by those who dislike or are displeased by the film in some way and wish to justify their opinion.
2001 is a special case, given its particularly 'musical' composition and episodic, epic nature, which encourage a continued tinkering. This was also the late 60s, never again would Kubrick enact such drastic changes...
...except in the case of The Shining, which was an attempt to make a more commercial genre film, thus the attempt to tighten the pace inbetween the US and European releases (although both cuts remain available). He also cut a brief coda after the premiere, but there is no such scene that might be obviously cut from Eyes Wide Shut.
A Clockwork Orange, Barry Lyndon and Full Metal Jacket remain pretty much as is. So I see no evidence to suggest that the EWS would have changed, though one cannot, of course, entirely reject the possibility. However, it seems to me the argument is primarily used by those who dislike or are displeased by the film in some way and wish to justify their opinion.
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Finally, HD (and new SD DVD) releases of more Kubrick.
SOURCEKubrick fans rejoice! After a year of waiting, Warner Home Video has finally announced the Blu-ray and HD DVD releases of a quartet of the director's most revered classics.
On October 23, Warner will debut remastered special editions of four Kubrick classics: '2001: A Space Odyssey,' 'A Clockwork Orange,' 'The Shining' and 'Eyes Wide Shut.'
The releases are set to debut simultaneously on Blu-ray, HD DVD and standard-def DVD, with each title available separately as a stand-alone release. Currently, the studio has not indicated whether the titles will also be bundled together as a box set collection.
Supplemental details for the four titles have also not yet been revealed, but tech specs on the next-gen versions will include 1080p video transfers and remixed Dolby TrueHD 5.1 audio tracks on both the Blu-ray and HD DVD editions.
Retail price is $28.99 a piece for each Kubrick classic.
In anticipation of the full press release with final confirmed details, we've added listings for all four titles to both our Blu-ray Release Schedule and HD DVD Release Schedule, under October 23. Needless to say, stay tuned!
Just cut them up like regular chickens
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Full details on the new HD Kubrick discs. Eyes Wide Shut is finally uncensored in the US:
2001: A Space Odyssey (1968)
Stanley Kubrick’s dazzling, Academy Award-winning achievement (Special Visual Effects) is an allegorical puzzle on the evolution of man and a compelling drama of man vs. machine. Featuring a stunning meld of music and motion, the film was also Oscar® nominated for Best Director and Best Screenplay. Kubrick (who co-wrote the screenplay with Arthur C. Clarke) first visits the prehistoric age-ancestry past, then leaps millennia (via one of the most mind-blowing jump cuts ever) into colonized space, and ultimately whisks astronaut Bowman (Keir Dullea) into uncharted space, perhaps even into immortality.
Using a dual-layer Blu-ray Disc (BD50) and dual-layer HD DVD (HD30) features include:
1080P 2.20:1 Widescreen
English PCM 5.1 Surround (Blu-ray Disc)
English Dolby True HD 5.1 Surround (HD DVD)
English, French and Spanish 5.1 Surround (Dolby Digital on Blu-ray, Dolby Digital Plus on HD DVD)
English, French and Spanish subtitles
Commentary by Keir Dullea and Gary Lockwood
Theatrical trailer
Channel 4 documentary: 2001: The Making of a Myth
Standing on the Shoulders of Kubrick: The Legacy of 2001
Vision of a Future Passed: The Prophecy of 2001
2001: A Space Odyssey - A Look Behind the Future
2001: FX and Early Conceptual Artwork
Look: Stanley Kubrick!
Audio-only interview with Stanley Kubrick
A Clockwork Orange (1971)
Stomping, whopping, stealing, singing, tap-dancing, violating. Derby-topped hooligan Alex (Malcolm McDowell) has a good time – at the tragic expense of others. His journey from amoral punk to brainwashed proper citizen and back again forms the dynamic arc of Kubrick’s future-shock vision of Anthony Burgess’ novel. Controversial when first released, the film garnered three Academy Award nominations – Best Picture, Best Director and Best Screenplay. Its power still entices, shocks and mesmerizes today.
Using a single dual-layer Blu-ray Disc (BD50) and two dual-layer HD DVD discs (HD30s) features include:
1080P 1.66:1 Widescreen
English Dolby True HD 5.1 Surround
English, French and Spanish 5.1 Surround (Dolby Digital on BD, Dolby Digital Plus on HD DVD)
English, French and Spanish subtitles
Commentary by Malcolm McDowell and historian Nick Redman
Theatrical trailer
Channel 4 documentary: Still Tickin’: The Return of Clockwork Orange
New featurette: Great Bolshy Yarblockos! Making A Clockwork Orange
Career profile: O Lucky Malcolm!
Eyes Wide Shut (1999)
Kubrick’s daring and controversial last film is a bracing psychosexual journey through a haunting dreamscape, a riveting suspense tale and a career milestone for stars Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman. Cruise plays a doctor who plunges into an erotic foray that threatens his marriage – and may ensnare him in a murder mystery – after his wife’s (Kidman) admission of sexual longings. As the story sweeps from doubt and fear to self-discovery and reconciliation, Kubrick orchestrates it with masterful flourishes. His graceful tracking shots, rich colors and startling images are some of the bravura traits that show Kubrick as a filmmaker for the ages.
Using a dual-layer Blu-ray Disc (BD50) and dual-layer HD DVD (HD30) features include:
1080P 1.78: Widescreen
English, French and Spanish subtitles
Scene specific commentary by Sydney Pollack and historian Peter Loewenberg
Theatrical trailer and TV spots
Channel 4 documentary: The Last Movie: Stanley Kubrick and Eyes Wide Shut
Lost Kubrick: The Unfinished Films of Stanley Kubrick
Kubrick’s 1998 DGA D.W Griffith Award acceptance speech
Interview gallery featuring Tom Cruise, Nicole Kidman, and Steven Spielberg
Full Metal Jacket (1987)
A superb ensemble falls in for Stanley Kubrick’s brilliant saga about the Vietnam War and the dehumanizing process that turns people into trained killers. The scathing indictment of a film was nominated for an Academy Award® for Best Screenplay. Joker (Matthew Modine), Animal Mother (Adam Baldwin), Gomer (Vincent D’Onofrio), Eightball (Dorian Harewood) and Cowboy (Arliss Howard) are some of the Marine recruits experiencing boot-camp hell under the punishing command of the foul-mouthed Sergeant Hartman (R. Lee Ermy). The action is savage, the story unsparing, and the dialogue is spiked with scathing humor.
Features include:
1080P 1.78:1 Widescreen
English Dolby True HD 5.1 Surround
English, French and Spanish 5.1 Surround (Dolby Digital on BD, Dolby Digital Plus on HD DVD)
Commentary by Adam Baldwin, Vincent D’Onofrio, R. Lee Ermey and Jay Cocks
New Featurette: Full Metal Jacket: Between Good and Evil
Theatrical trailer
The Shining (1980)
From a script he co-adapted from the Stephen King novel, Kubrick melds vivid performances, menacing settings, dreamlike tracking shots and shock after shock into a milestone of the macabre. The Shining is the director’s epic tale of a man in a snowbound hotel descending into murderous delusions. In a signature role, Jack Nicholson (“Heeeere’s Johnny!”) stars as Jack Torrance, who’s come to the elegant, isolated Overlook Hotel as off-season caretaker with his wife (Shelley Duvall) and son (Danny Lloyd).
Using a dual-layer Blu-ray Disc (BD50) and dual-layer HD DVD (HD30) features include:
1080P 1.78:1 Widescreen
English Dolby True HD 5.1 Surround
English, French and Spanish 5.1 Surround (Dolby Digital on BD, Dolby Digital Plus on HD DVD)
English, French and Spanish subtitles
Commentary by Garrett Brown and John Baxter
Theatrical trailer
Documentary The Making of the Shining, with optional commentary by Vivian Kubrick
Three new featurettes:
View from The Overlook: Crafting the Shining
The Visions of Stanley Kubrick
Wendy Carlos, Composer
Just cut them up like regular chickens
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It's a shame that someone can't track down the original ending of the Shining. I'll bet anything it's buried somewhere deep in the Warners vault.
This is a snakeskin jacket. And for me it's a symbol of my individuality and my belief in personal freedom.
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Actually it's in my vault with the 12 hour cut of Dune and the 4 hour cut of FWWM.O-dot wrote:It's a shame that someone can't track down the original ending of the Shining. I'll bet anything it's buried somewhere deep in the Warners vault.
Just cut them up like regular chickens
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It's not video, but someone on the IMDb boards has located stills from the deleted hospital scene in The Shining:
This is a snakeskin jacket. And for me it's a symbol of my individuality and my belief in personal freedom.
35
Some interesting comments from Jan Harlan, SK's executive producer, on some of the issues we've discussed here. Full interview here:
Q: I remember a concluding scene from The Shining - with Barry Nelson - that was shown at critics previews that Kubrick cut for the general release and hasn't been seen since. Why? Does the scene still exist? Did he ever evince second thoughts about those last-minute cutting decisions?
For that matter, when looking at one of his old movies, did he ever see things he wished he'd cut when he had the chance?
A: The Shining came out in the U.S. first. Many voices suggested that the film was a bit long. Other suggestions were that the poster was wrong. Stanley listened. He changed the campaign and poster design and made some cuts in the film before its release in the rest of the world. Stanley was not stubborn or vain, he was willing to make changes as long as he would be the one making them.
No, these scenes no longer exist. I am not aware of any second thoughts about other decisions. If at all, then it would be the other way around. He may have regretted taking too much out of Barry Lyndon, for example.
Q: How do you feel the unblocked sex in Eyes Wide Shut affects the film, as opposed to the American theatrical version?
A: I feel it is right to unblock these scenes. Stanley would have been most astonished about the request in the first place. The scene in question shows a modern hell in a world where pornography is exploding.
Widespread dissatisfaction in this area is evident and artists of all times have been known to hold a mirror up. Some don't like to look into it. Just too bad.
Q: In line with the last-minute cuts on 2001 and The Shining, since Eyes Wide Shut was months from release when Kubrick died, there's at least some possibility that Kubrick would have trimmed the film further. Any idea what might have been cut?
A: He would have re-cut the so-called "orgy" scene in order to comply with the rules to get the "R" rating, which we were contractually bound by. He would not have changed anything in substance, only in form.
This is a snakeskin jacket. And for me it's a symbol of my individuality and my belief in personal freedom.
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You know very well that Mike possesses a copy of that longer Barry Lyndon cut. 
This is a snakeskin jacket. And for me it's a symbol of my individuality and my belief in personal freedom.
38
Just what the world needs, 40 more minutes of Ryan O'Neal in pantaloons. W00t w00t.
"I'm like a dog chasing cars, I wouldn't know what to do if I caught one. . . . I'm not a schemer. I just do things."
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The longer Barry Lyndon cut is in the vault underneath the 54 hour cut of Lynch's Dune.
I watched 2001 on blu-ray last weekend. Aside from some print damage, it was nothing short of amazing. Not as good as seeing it in the original super panavision 70 of course, but a 65mm negative translates damn well to HD.
I watched 2001 on blu-ray last weekend. Aside from some print damage, it was nothing short of amazing. Not as good as seeing it in the original super panavision 70 of course, but a 65mm negative translates damn well to HD.
Just cut them up like regular chickens
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watched a sad-old SD DVD of 2001 last night; still good though, yeah, just a memento of the 70mm projection experience. Sigh... HD-DVD still isn't available here, ridiculously... I'd have to import from the US or something, or get a PlayStation. Sigh. And, even then, I still can't afford 1080P projector 
Quite a torment, seeing that Full Metal Jacket has been remastered...
Quite a torment, seeing that Full Metal Jacket has been remastered...