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Now that the embargo is lifted the reviews for this have been pretty brutal. It's currently rocking a 34% on Rotten Tomatoes and the reviews make it sound like a Michael Bay Transformers type of film. That said, I'm still planning on seeing it this weekend because all the cool kids are.
Just cut them up like regular chickens

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what i've read basically says there is no real reason for them to be fighting like they are, and that it doesn't make a lot of logical sense.

here's my problem: DC is in trouble in the movie biz. i mean, seriously. marvel is killing it six ways from sunday and DC keeps pumping out shit. there are good ideas in the DC universe, though, and the current crop in charge of some of their shit ideas keep burning some good source material so that we may never see a good version of it, "what could have been". green lantern has good material and a massive cross-over-ish universe. the dark knight returns material is fantastic. list goes on. they have invested a ton of money and the future is already planned/being made. i feel like they are in the midst of the gambler's fallacy, where they feel like they've invested so much already, might as well keep going. if they can't nail their top two characters, what hope do wonder woman, aquaman and the like have? they are going to burn it for this generation, which is fucking sad.

should we go back to the shadow with baldwin? they simply don't understand how to make movies.

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Like you said, there's tons of potential with the DC characters but they jus't can't seem to tap into that potential one bit.

I'd love to see a movie version of Kingdom Come (as I think I've said before). One of the better Supes vs Bats stories ever told.

Re: Batman-Superman

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darkness wrote:Now that the embargo is lifted the reviews for this have been pretty brutal. It's currently rocking a 34% on Rotten Tomatoes and the reviews make it sound like a Michael Bay Transformers type of film. That said, I'm still planning on seeing it this weekend because all the cool kids are.
Yeah, going Friday too. Fortunately it's a theater that serves alcohol. To TC's points, I just think they pulled a major boner by putting all of their eggs in the Snyder/Goyer basket. Neither are particularly good at their jobs. Snyder can rock fight scenes but even then, as we saw with Man of Steel, he goes overboard and just exhausts the audience. I am expecting more of the same with this. I get the broad motivation for Batman not trusting Superman, but I also don't doubt that they've figured out a way to screw that up. Several reviews I've skimmed say there's a ton of action without motivation throughout the film, just illogical shit.
"I'm like a dog chasing cars, I wouldn't know what to do if I caught one. . . . I'm not a schemer. I just do things."

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I think part of the problem the DC Universe movies have is that they let the film studio (WB) and Snyder call the shots on things, none of whom really are from the comic side of things and understand the characters or how to do a good comic character film. They still labor under the cliche that "comic movie" is a genre of it's own and if you just make it look arty and throw in some fights that's all that is needed. Whereas Marvel comes at it from the approach of the comic book studio producing the films, uses people who know the characters and how to tell stories with them. And they also understand that there are different genres within the stories that can be told with the characters (Ant-man the heist film, Winter Soldier the espionage thriller and so on). At Marvel the people who know the characters and stories best keep the studio folks from fucking things up (sorry Edgar Wright fellators). The borrow from the best stories of the comics while understanding that film and print are different mediums and adapt accordingly. On the DC side of things there appears to be no or little input from DC comics or it's writers, and Snyder seems to pretty much ignore anything from the comics. As near as I can tell the only thing Batman/Superman seems to have in common with The Dark Knight Returns is that both Batman and Superman are in it and they fight each other (in the case of the film it sounds like for no reason).

TC, if you want to see good versions of the DC source material on the screen, I highly suggest checking out the animated features if you haven't already. They've been doing really good adaptions of stories sourced from the comics. They've already done Dark Night Returns and Killing Joke is coming soon. Every person who says it's hard to do a solo Wonder Woman film all these years clearly never saw the animated one that came out back in 2009.
Just cut them up like regular chickens

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darkness wrote:I think part of the problem the DC Universe movies have is that they let the film studio (WB) and Snyder call the shots on things, none of whom really are from the comic side of things and understand the characters or how to do a good comic character film. They still labor under the cliche that "comic movie" is a genre of it's own and if you just make it look arty and throw in some fights that's all that is needed. Whereas Marvel comes at it from the approach of the comic book studio producing the films, uses people who know the characters and how to tell stories with them. And they also understand that there are different genres within the stories that can be told with the characters (Ant-man the heist film, Winter Soldier the espionage thriller and so on). At Marvel the people who know the characters and stories best keep the studio folks from fucking things up (sorry Edgar Wright fellators). The borrow from the best stories of the comics while understanding that film and print are different mediums and adapt accordingly. On the DC side of things there appears to be no or little input from DC comics or it's writers, and Snyder seems to pretty much ignore anything from the comics. As near as I can tell the only thing Batman/Superman seems to have in common with The Dark Knight Returns is that both Batman and Superman are in it and they fight each other (in the case of the film it sounds like for no reason).

TC, if you want to see good versions of the DC source material on the screen, I highly suggest checking out the animated features if you haven't already. They've been doing really good adaptions of stories sourced from the comics. They've already done Dark Night Returns and Killing Joke is coming soon. Every person who says it's hard to do a solo Wonder Woman film all these years clearly never saw the animated one that came out back in 2009.
Very well said. And I'm pretty sure Geoff Johns is heavily involved with DC t.v., which is probably why they are having much better creative luck there. I know Goyer has a deep geek resume but he's never done anything that's been particularly good outside of the Nolan films, maybe the first couple Blades. He even said something to the effect of "I can't believe I'm involved with this good of a film" when Dark Knight came out. Us too, David.
"I'm like a dog chasing cars, I wouldn't know what to do if I caught one. . . . I'm not a schemer. I just do things."

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Just got back. I have to say, I'm surprisingly pleased with the whole thing. If you are paying money to see a movie with this title, you get your money's worth.
"I'm like a dog chasing cars, I wouldn't know what to do if I caught one. . . . I'm not a schemer. I just do things."

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Let me be clear--I've always loved Batman. So if you do justice to Batman in a movie or show, I'll probably give you some benefit of the doubt. And I like a whole heck of a lot of things about Batman in this movie.
"I'm like a dog chasing cars, I wouldn't know what to do if I caught one. . . . I'm not a schemer. I just do things."

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This is actually a really, really good Superman movie too. It is in many respects his film, and I like his character arc. Many shout outs/nods to previous cinematic and comic iterations of both characters as well.
"I'm like a dog chasing cars, I wouldn't know what to do if I caught one. . . . I'm not a schemer. I just do things."

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I think DC looked at the box office take of the Batman films and the take of the last two Superman films, which were quite a bit lower, and thought, hey, let's include Batman so we can try to get the grosses up. Purely a financial decision rather than a storytelling one.
Just cut them up like regular chickens

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Oh sure. But for me, anyway, it works, and is at its core a Superman film in many respects. I saw it again with the kids today.
"I'm like a dog chasing cars, I wouldn't know what to do if I caught one. . . . I'm not a schemer. I just do things."